I just posted my experience with supposedly Gothic conventions elsewhere, but I thought I should perhaps start an actual entry thang about it.
GothCon in New Orleans did not impress me, but I had a great suite at a non-sucky hotel and had a lot of fun in Louisiana with my pals.
Convergence in Las Vegas, on the other hand, was the single worst convention I think I have ever been to under any circumstance anywhere, but I had a pretty good suite at a non-sucky hotel and had a lot of fun in Nevada with my pals.
Why do people who try to throw these things (a) get the worst hotels possible, (b) totally fail to put on decent programming, (c) inspire an atmosphere of unfriendliness, and (d) suck.
DON’T YOU BAD-MOUTH CONVERGENCE!!! THE CONVERGENCE GNOMES WILL SEND THEIR… umm… SHIT-TALKERS OUT TO SMEAR YOU!!!!
heh…
Didn’t go, but a lot of people who did both *that* and the PFT show that my friend subrina organised (and I DJ’d) said they liked *her* event better.
DON’T YOU BAD-MOUTH CONVERGENCE!!! THE CONVERGENCE GNOMES WILL SEND THEIR… umm… SHIT-TALKERS OUT TO SMEAR YOU!!!!
heh…
Didn’t go, but a lot of people who did both *that* and the PFT show that my friend subrina organised (and I DJ’d) said they liked *her* event better.
Because cons attract allot of poseurs that think their shit don’t stink so they feel the need to make everybody miserable.
I hate that most of them throw them in like 200.00 a night hotels.None of us real undergraound people can afford that shit so that is why the faux people take over.
Because cons attract allot of poseurs that think their shit don’t stink so they feel the need to make everybody miserable.
I hate that most of them throw them in like 200.00 a night hotels.None of us real undergraound people can afford that shit so that is why the faux people take over.
From my experience running a non-Goth ‘net-based convention (Electronicon in ’97, acknowledged by most as the first international classic video game fan convention), and my years of being a spectator and occasional participant in “The Annual Convergence Argument”, it comes down to this first and foremost: democracy doesn’t really work when running one of these things. It discouraged me from continuing with my convention, and I see people bang their heads against the wall with Convergence and such every time I look. You try to please everybody, and you end up pleasing nobody. It spreads the people working on the event out too thin, waters down any vision you had for the event in the first place, people argue with you the whole way, and no matter how many concessions you make, they’re STILL not happy. You’re much better off being “the bad guy” in the short-term, and having people eat crow when they see that you’ve really put together something good. Give folks a chance to take advantage…oh, hell, you know this already, and so do your readers.
Some Convergences haven’t been so bad. 5 was the best-run that I’ve seen, and even that was a little chaotic because of some organizational issues (passes not showing up in the right places, etc….nothing huge, but some stress for some people that probably could’ve been avoided…). Others (4 had MAJOR hotel issues, 6 delivered Peter Murphy but failed to deliver on promises to under-21s attending, 7…yeah, anyway…) weren’t so lucky. I missed 8 and 9 (and most of the planning involved), and I’ll be missing 10 just because I already know of too many people attending who give me a headache, but I’ve been around for at least part of the 4-7 processes, and attended 3 out of 4 of those.
The hotel thing has to do with two things: first, there are usually people with limited event planning experience (and tourist experience, being that it’s their home city usually) making the hotel decisions; second, no matter how cheap the official hotel is, every year, people bitch that it’s not cheap enough, so it forces the event planners to lower the bar. These things are supposed to be fucking VACATIONS, folks! Indulge a little! If the prices are still too high and you want to see people, use the power of that great community you’re a part of to find crash space with friends locally, or share rooms, but don’t ruin things for people who don’t mind paying for a little comfort!
Programming, see above comments on “trying to please everybody”.
Unfriendliness, also see above comments on arguments.
You do, in the course of this post, bring up the single most important point of going to these things, though: having fun with your friends. For most people going aside from the vendors, they’re not really “business” events, and the programming (bands, whatever) have always been pretty superfluous to enjoying yourself at a Convergence. The point of a con like Convergence or GothCon or whatever is for people who talk all the time but don’t get to see each other face-to-face very often to catch up, meet each other, have a good time, and (unless you’re me) get totally shitfaced. 😀 I don’t think basic, open-ended entertainment is the worst idea in the world for these events, but the key really is keeping it simple. Alas, as you and I both know, so many in this scene are a little on the overly ambitious, self-important side. 😉 I do agree on the hotels, though. The 2 hotels they had us set up in at C5 were solid enough, and that made attending a lot more fun as a result.
Here’s my question to you: you’re at conventions all the time, to the point where it seems like you and Forrest practically live at them. Assuming you were ever enough of a masochist to run one of these things, how would YOU do it?
From my experience running a non-Goth ‘net-based convention (Electronicon in ’97, acknowledged by most as the first international classic video game fan convention), and my years of being a spectator and occasional participant in “The Annual Convergence Argument”, it comes down to this first and foremost: democracy doesn’t really work when running one of these things. It discouraged me from continuing with my convention, and I see people bang their heads against the wall with Convergence and such every time I look. You try to please everybody, and you end up pleasing nobody. It spreads the people working on the event out too thin, waters down any vision you had for the event in the first place, people argue with you the whole way, and no matter how many concessions you make, they’re STILL not happy. You’re much better off being “the bad guy” in the short-term, and having people eat crow when they see that you’ve really put together something good. Give folks a chance to take advantage…oh, hell, you know this already, and so do your readers.
Some Convergences haven’t been so bad. 5 was the best-run that I’ve seen, and even that was a little chaotic because of some organizational issues (passes not showing up in the right places, etc….nothing huge, but some stress for some people that probably could’ve been avoided…). Others (4 had MAJOR hotel issues, 6 delivered Peter Murphy but failed to deliver on promises to under-21s attending, 7…yeah, anyway…) weren’t so lucky. I missed 8 and 9 (and most of the planning involved), and I’ll be missing 10 just because I already know of too many people attending who give me a headache, but I’ve been around for at least part of the 4-7 processes, and attended 3 out of 4 of those.
The hotel thing has to do with two things: first, there are usually people with limited event planning experience (and tourist experience, being that it’s their home city usually) making the hotel decisions; second, no matter how cheap the official hotel is, every year, people bitch that it’s not cheap enough, so it forces the event planners to lower the bar. These things are supposed to be fucking VACATIONS, folks! Indulge a little! If the prices are still too high and you want to see people, use the power of that great community you’re a part of to find crash space with friends locally, or share rooms, but don’t ruin things for people who don’t mind paying for a little comfort!
Programming, see above comments on “trying to please everybody”.
Unfriendliness, also see above comments on arguments.
You do, in the course of this post, bring up the single most important point of going to these things, though: having fun with your friends. For most people going aside from the vendors, they’re not really “business” events, and the programming (bands, whatever) have always been pretty superfluous to enjoying yourself at a Convergence. The point of a con like Convergence or GothCon or whatever is for people who talk all the time but don’t get to see each other face-to-face very often to catch up, meet each other, have a good time, and (unless you’re me) get totally shitfaced. 😀 I don’t think basic, open-ended entertainment is the worst idea in the world for these events, but the key really is keeping it simple. Alas, as you and I both know, so many in this scene are a little on the overly ambitious, self-important side. 😉 I do agree on the hotels, though. The 2 hotels they had us set up in at C5 were solid enough, and that made attending a lot more fun as a result.
Here’s my question to you: you’re at conventions all the time, to the point where it seems like you and Forrest practically live at them. Assuming you were ever enough of a masochist to run one of these things, how would YOU do it?
I’d be the bad guy in the short term and expect people to eat crow when it rocked, but they wouldn’t and that would bug me. I think that might be my life in a nutshell, lol.
The C9 hotel entryway smelled like what one friend of mine described as a combo of rotten eggs and ass. I think the ideal hotel is a nice one that has an area where people can look “disturbing” without disturbing other guests. A great convention hotel has serviceable rooms with a good convention rate and turns a blind eye when people share, BUT it also has nice suites where people who want to throw parties for their friends can book. Definitely a convention should not be held in a hotel which is so grody it has no alcohol license and the cockroaches are unsure about the bathtub.
I think, if a convention has entertainment, it should be actually GOOD — panel discussions of interest to attendees, performers attendees care about, parties attendees will enjoy etc. If a convention does not have entertainment and is just a meeting place, then registration should be VERY LITTLE $.
I’d be the bad guy in the short term and expect people to eat crow when it rocked, but they wouldn’t and that would bug me. I think that might be my life in a nutshell, lol.
The C9 hotel entryway smelled like what one friend of mine described as a combo of rotten eggs and ass. I think the ideal hotel is a nice one that has an area where people can look “disturbing” without disturbing other guests. A great convention hotel has serviceable rooms with a good convention rate and turns a blind eye when people share, BUT it also has nice suites where people who want to throw parties for their friends can book. Definitely a convention should not be held in a hotel which is so grody it has no alcohol license and the cockroaches are unsure about the bathtub.
I think, if a convention has entertainment, it should be actually GOOD — panel discussions of interest to attendees, performers attendees care about, parties attendees will enjoy etc. If a convention does not have entertainment and is just a meeting place, then registration should be VERY LITTLE $.
i’ve heard good things about gothcruise…and i am trying to scrape up the dough for the next one…(and even if the gothiness part of it sucks its still a great cruise;)
i’ve heard good things about gothcruise…and i am trying to scrape up the dough for the next one…(and even if the gothiness part of it sucks its still a great cruise;)
What would make a GOOD Gothic convention???
So far the only conventions I’ve seen work well is when massive amounts of competition is the focus. This was their is at lest the feeling of a purpose around. Ones where the only thing expected is to show up and hang out will suck no matter what…their has to be something of a grand purpose to it all.
Though lifestyle and profession conventions are always hit or miss to be honest. Plus people are generally dicks at stuff like that these days. Either the “hardcore” get too elitest…or the posers get everything so half assed backwards it’s a joke. Their is no middleground it seems.
What would make a GOOD Gothic convention???
So far the only conventions I’ve seen work well is when massive amounts of competition is the focus. This was their is at lest the feeling of a purpose around. Ones where the only thing expected is to show up and hang out will suck no matter what…their has to be something of a grand purpose to it all.
Though lifestyle and profession conventions are always hit or miss to be honest. Plus people are generally dicks at stuff like that these days. Either the “hardcore” get too elitest…or the posers get everything so half assed backwards it’s a joke. Their is no middleground it seems.
HAHAHAHA I couldn’t have said that better myself.I know the fun of the Convergence shit talkers.HAHAH.Ohhhh I’m sure we all live in fear of them.HAHA
HAHAHAHA I couldn’t have said that better myself.I know the fun of the Convergence shit talkers.HAHAH.Ohhhh I’m sure we all live in fear of them.HAHA
I was on the first GothCruise, and it was the most fun vacation I’ve ever had in my life. Okay, maybe my honeymoon was the most fun, GothCruise was the second most fun.
We weren’t really trying to be ubergoth and sp00ky, it was more about getting together a fun group of people and having a good party that raged on for days. Besides, when you’re in a group of goths, anything can be goth if there’s alcohol involved, and on that boat, there was plenty. We had a couple of dance nights and enjoyed terrorizing the normals as we ranged the ship as our freaky little selves. For the most part, people were very cool with us, the overall harassment was low to nil, and it was a great, great time. And it’s weird seeing people in full goth gear on the beach in broad daylight- I went to a cool beach club in Cozumel and the proprietress was deeply amused that my hubby and I were both wearing combat boots on the beach.
It was a great time- I’ve already got my deposit down for the next one.
I was on the first GothCruise, and it was the most fun vacation I’ve ever had in my life. Okay, maybe my honeymoon was the most fun, GothCruise was the second most fun.
We weren’t really trying to be ubergoth and sp00ky, it was more about getting together a fun group of people and having a good party that raged on for days. Besides, when you’re in a group of goths, anything can be goth if there’s alcohol involved, and on that boat, there was plenty. We had a couple of dance nights and enjoyed terrorizing the normals as we ranged the ship as our freaky little selves. For the most part, people were very cool with us, the overall harassment was low to nil, and it was a great, great time. And it’s weird seeing people in full goth gear on the beach in broad daylight- I went to a cool beach club in Cozumel and the proprietress was deeply amused that my hubby and I were both wearing combat boots on the beach.
It was a great time- I’ve already got my deposit down for the next one.
Yeah, I don’t know what they’re so afraid of — I know at least one of those people to, in fact, be a fake biker. This means he dresses like a biker, but he’s a computer programmer who rides a friggin’ tricycle with a motor on it!
Yeah, I don’t know what they’re so afraid of — I know at least one of those people to, in fact, be a fake biker. This means he dresses like a biker, but he’s a computer programmer who rides a friggin’ tricycle with a motor on it!
rock on…the more and more i talk to people the more i am pushing to get on this (and everyone else i can get to go with me)
rock on…the more and more i talk to people the more i am pushing to get on this (and everyone else i can get to go with me)
O God that is a fucking riot.LOL.They are all a FAKE something or other but real assholes.HAHAH.OMG wait we better not talk on here they may talk on us…Wait never mind they already do.HAHA
O God that is a fucking riot.LOL.They are all a FAKE something or other but real assholes.HAHAH.OMG wait we better not talk on here they may talk on us…Wait never mind they already do.HAHA
even though C9 sucked ass im glad i met you and forrest.
you guys are awsome!
and it made me feel really good to know that people actually WANT to see me naked ;P
even though C9 sucked ass im glad i met you and forrest.
you guys are awsome!
and it made me feel really good to know that people actually WANT to see me naked ;P
Hell, yeah, baby!
But think how much more convenient it would have been if we could have just gone up to our suite, rather than having to wait for the convention to end for the day, so we could drive to a hotel that wasn’t grody. C9 could have at least negotiated an econo price if they were going to be in a grody hotel, but no.
Meeting you rocked though!
Hell, yeah, baby!
But think how much more convenient it would have been if we could have just gone up to our suite, rather than having to wait for the convention to end for the day, so we could drive to a hotel that wasn’t grody. C9 could have at least negotiated an econo price if they were going to be in a grody hotel, but no.
Meeting you rocked though!
🙂 i really want to do another shoot with you guys soon. im working on growing my sides out so i can cut a side hawk and dye it bright pink then im going to dye my hawk electric blue and im going to cut checker board liberty spikes on the other side and dye them black. its going to look really awsome.
my band might be going out there to play a show at bar sinister in april.
just let me know if you are interested.
if not mabe we can party after the show 😉
🙂 i really want to do another shoot with you guys soon. im working on growing my sides out so i can cut a side hawk and dye it bright pink then im going to dye my hawk electric blue and im going to cut checker board liberty spikes on the other side and dye them black. its going to look really awsome.
my band might be going out there to play a show at bar sinister in april.
just let me know if you are interested.
if not mabe we can party after the show 😉